Zarco said his brakes were fading and blamed that as to why the crash occurred. Sent from my iPad > On Aug 17, 2020, at 8:30 PM, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > >  > Precisely. > What made the crash really heart-stopping was the speed and the trajectory of the smashed plunging wild bikes. VR & MV almost got killed. Any other way would’ve been just a high speed crash and everyone just moves along. Nothing to see.. just like when MM93 crashed In Italy at similar speed. > > > > > > > >> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 7:02 PM Kevin Kachadourian <kkachadourian@gmail.com> wrote: >> Okay, I'm going to say "yes" to all three of Lan's questions. >> >> It was a bad move on Zarco's part. They were both at high speeds, it was dangerous to say the least to brake as you are passing at that point in the track, knowing it will stand you up and move you in front of the other bike. It was a bad move, but was it intentional, I can't read Zarco's mind. Is there a history in MotoGP of riders doing similar moves? Of course. What made this one spectacular was the speed. If they had hit at 40 mph, we probably would not be talking about it (and Rossi would not be praying after the race). >> >> It was a racing incident. As I said before, it was the speed that make it so spectacular, with tragic possibilities, but how do you write a rule for that situation that does not take some of the battle out of MotoGP and/or get bogged down in battles of words and opinions about many close passes or contacts on the race track? >> >> T3 is a bad sector, but how do you fix it, and what to do about this weekend, when any number of riders, not just Zarco, will have an opportunity to repeat this performance (and, remember that Rossi used up his 9th life in the last incident). Here's a ridiculous idea: since the bikes' computers are mapped for each area of the track (at least they used to be), let's just change the mapping so that all engines go to one half throttle from the apex of T2 to the apex of T3. >> >> Any other bad ideas? >> >>> On Mon, 17 Aug 2020 at 14:24, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Someone explain VR and FM’s accusations, theory or what have you, that Zarco braked and/or went wide intentionally to block Morbi at ~300kph. That just Sounds insane to me. >>> >>> It seems that If a rider enters that corner at the clipping point of the kink at ~300kph, the bike will tend to go outwards (wide) during exit. >>> Naturally, Before entering that corner, the rider would want to go a little on the outside to set up the flow before entering that kink. When Morbi did that, Zarco saw an “open” door and went for it. The Ducati is so fast in the straights that it was able to pass Morbi. As Morbi was going in, Zarco already made the pass and he had to stand up the bike, both going naturally “wide” at really high speed. Then, BaM!! >>> >>> Was it bad move on Zarco’s part? >>> Was it just a racing incident? >>> Or T3 is just a bad sector? >>> >>> >>> Everyone keeps on condemning Zarco on his racing style that isn’t even that aggressive. The fact is, most of them new generation are all aggressive. MM93 is very aggressive and so was VR. >>> >>> Pol hit him last week because pol is a dick. Erratic high tempered person. Couldn’t compose himself and kept making so many errors like an amateur. Binder kicked his ass fair and square. >>> >>> And Morbi hit Zarco this week.not the other way around. >>> >>> If y’all can’t take danger of the sport, it’s time to watch golf. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 10:06 AM Tony Pags <ajpags@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> In this case, MOR wasn't following too closely, he was passed by Zarco. >>>> >>>> Pags >>>> >>>>> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 9:59 AM Scottie Ducati <scottieducati@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> Different riders and bikes/setups have different braking points. Some brake early with less force, some brake later with tons of force. >>>>> >>>>> Never follow too closely if you aren't aware of where the rider ahead uses for their braking marker. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >>>> http://www.ductalk.com/ >>>> and >>>> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >>>> _____________________ >>>> Ducati mailing list >>>> Ducati@list.ducati.net >>>> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >>>> Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com >>> -- >>> sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >>> http://www.ductalk.com/ >>> and >>> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >>> _____________________ >>> Ducati mailing list >>> Ducati@list.ducati.net >>> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >> >>> Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >> http://www.ductalk.com/ >> and >> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >> _____________________ >> Ducati mailing list >> Ducati@list.ducati.net >> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >> Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com > -- > sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: kmlamm@gmail.com

Zarco’s telemetry: ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 2:29 PM Kenneth Lamm <kmlamm@gmail.com> wrote: > Zarco said his brakes were fading and blamed that as to why the crash > occurred. > > Sent from my iPad > > > -- sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ #

That means next to nothing - I can cut you off and "brake later", in fact, that's exactly what I would expect here. Don't "Brake in my face" as Rossi put it. I have a hard time believing Zarco wasn't at fault here. Not saying it was heinous or malicious, but he certainly didn't seem to complete the pass safely in my mind. Pags On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 10:58 PM Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > Zarco’s telemetry: > > ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of > the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ > > >

Look at it from another point of view. What if the telemetry shows he braked earlier? Now that’s braking in morbis face. He braked later than any other lap before the crash; It means he didn’t brake in his face as he was aware Morbi was there. What he wasn’t aware of was how close Morbi was from either tailgating or getting dragged in from The slip stream. Morbi was tailgating/sucked in to the braking point and rammed into Zarco. . Didn’t he see Zarco already made the pass before he even entered the kink? Why continue to accelerate? Because they’re racers and they didn’t know the impact of their action, more so on Morbi on that exact sector of the track. Now that they know, no one will dare to replicate it. Do you really think Zarco brake checked morbi? Zarco hit nobody. He had to brake eventually... what do you think would’ve happened if Zarco didn’t brake at the latest braking point? The pass was very clean, but they just both occupied the same space. On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 9:55 AM Tony Pags <ajpags@gmail.com> wrote: > That means next to nothing - I can cut you off and "brake later", in fact, > that's exactly what I would expect here. Don't "Brake in my face" as Rossi > put it. > I have a hard time believing Zarco wasn't at fault here. Not saying it > was heinous or malicious, but he certainly didn't seem to complete the pass > safely in my mind. > Pags > > On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 10:58 PM Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Zarco’s telemetry: >> >> ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of >> the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ >> >> >> > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com > -- sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ #

I wonder if all the analysis expands the perceived time span of the incident. It's like we cram 10 seconds worth of planning, calculating, perceiving, and reacting into 1 and 1/2 seconds. I'm not going to opine about this incident anymore. Have fun. On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 at 10:15, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > Look at it from another point of view. > What if the telemetry shows he braked earlier? > Now that’s braking in morbis face. > > > He braked later than any other lap before the crash; It means he didn’t > brake in his face as he was aware Morbi was there. What he wasn’t aware of > was how close Morbi was from either tailgating or getting dragged in from > The slip stream. Morbi was tailgating/sucked in to the braking point and > rammed into Zarco. . Didn’t he see Zarco already made the pass before he > even entered the kink? Why continue to accelerate? Because they’re racers > and they didn’t know the impact of their action, more so on Morbi on that > exact sector of the track. Now that they know, no one will dare to > replicate it. > > > Do you really think Zarco brake checked morbi? > > Zarco hit nobody. He had to brake eventually... > what do you think would’ve happened if Zarco didn’t brake at the latest > braking point? > > The pass was very clean, but they just both occupied the same space. > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 9:55 AM Tony Pags <ajpags@gmail.com> wrote: > >> That means next to nothing - I can cut you off and "brake later", in >> fact, that's exactly what I would expect here. Don't "Brake in my face" as >> Rossi put it. >> I have a hard time believing Zarco wasn't at fault here. Not saying it >> was heinous or malicious, but he certainly didn't seem to complete the pass >> safely in my mind. >> Pags >> >> On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 10:58 PM Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Zarco’s telemetry: >>> >>> ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of >>> the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >> http://www.ductalk.com/ >> and >> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >> _____________________ >> Ducati mailing list >> Ducati@list.ducati.net >> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >> Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com >> > -- > sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com >

It happened so fast. They need to analyze more videos and telemetry from Both Zarc and Morbis bikes, as well as a video from a heli. It’s very easy to analyze on paper with all the data, but sometimes these data and analysis are horseshit in the real world. On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 7:20 PM Kevin Kachadourian <kkachadourian@gmail.com> wrote: > I wonder if all the analysis expands the perceived time span of the > incident. It's like we cram 10 seconds worth of planning, calculating, > perceiving, and reacting into 1 and 1/2 seconds. > > I'm not going to opine about this incident anymore. > > Have fun. > > On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 at 10:15, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Look at it from another point of view. >> What if the telemetry shows he braked earlier? >> Now that’s braking in morbis face. >> >> >> He braked later than any other lap before the crash; It means he didn’t >> brake in his face as he was aware Morbi was there. What he wasn’t aware of >> was how close Morbi was from either tailgating or getting dragged in from >> The slip stream. Morbi was tailgating/sucked in to the braking point and >> rammed into Zarco. . Didn’t he see Zarco already made the pass before he >> even entered the kink? Why continue to accelerate? Because they’re racers >> and they didn’t know the impact of their action, more so on Morbi on that >> exact sector of the track. Now that they know, no one will dare to >> replicate it. >> >> >> Do you really think Zarco brake checked morbi? >> >> Zarco hit nobody. He had to brake eventually... >> what do you think would’ve happened if Zarco didn’t brake at the latest >> braking point? >> >> The pass was very clean, but they just both occupied the same space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 9:55 AM Tony Pags <ajpags@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> That means next to nothing - I can cut you off and "brake later", in >>> fact, that's exactly what I would expect here. Don't "Brake in my face" as >>> Rossi put it. >>> I have a hard time believing Zarco wasn't at fault here. Not saying it >>> was heinous or malicious, but he certainly didn't seem to complete the pass >>> safely in my mind. >>> Pags >>> >>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 10:58 PM Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Zarco’s telemetry: >>>> >>>> ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of >>>> the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >>> http://www.ductalk.com/ >>> and >>> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >>> _____________________ >>> Ducati mailing list >>> Ducati@list.ducati.net >>> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >>> Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com >>> >> -- >> sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # >> >> >> >> >> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: >> http://www.ductalk.com/ >> and >> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet >> _____________________ >> Ducati mailing list >> Ducati@list.ducati.net >> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net >> > Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com >> > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com > -- sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ #

It was a racing accident/incident. My view, neither rider was at fault. What needs to change, that left kinks needs to be straightened, so the trajectory of a crashing motorcycle, at high speed, does not take it across another part of the track. > On Aug 19, 2020, at 7:45 PM, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> wrote: > > It happened so fast. They need to analyze more videos and telemetry from Both Zarc and Morbis bikes, as well as a video from a heli. > > > It’s very easy to analyze on paper with all the data, but sometimes these data and analysis are horseshit in the real world. > > > On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 7:20 PM Kevin Kachadourian <kkachadourian@gmail.com <mailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com>> wrote: > I wonder if all the analysis expands the perceived time span of the incident. It's like we cram 10 seconds worth of planning, calculating, perceiving, and reacting into 1 and 1/2 seconds. > > I'm not going to opine about this incident anymore. > > Have fun. > > On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 at 10:15, Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com <mailto:nolanmaxxx@gmail.com>> wrote: > Look at it from another point of view. > What if the telemetry shows he braked earlier? > Now that’s braking in morbis face. > > > He braked later than any other lap before the crash; It means he didn’t brake in his face as he was aware Morbi was there. What he wasn’t aware of was how close Morbi was from either tailgating or getting dragged in from The slip stream. Morbi was tailgating/sucked in to the braking point and rammed into Zarco. . Didn’t he see Zarco already made the pass before he even entered the kink? Why continue to accelerate? Because they’re racers and they didn’t know the impact of their action, more so on Morbi on that exact sector of the track. Now that they know, no one will dare to replicate it. > > > Do you really think Zarco brake checked morbi? > > Zarco hit nobody. He had to brake eventually... > what do you think would’ve happened if Zarco didn’t brake at the latest braking point? > > The pass was very clean, but they just both occupied the same space. > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 9:55 AM Tony Pags <ajpags@gmail.com <mailto:ajpags@gmail.com>> wrote: > That means next to nothing - I can cut you off and "brake later", in fact, that's exactly what I would expect here. Don't "Brake in my face" as Rossi put it. > I have a hard time believing Zarco wasn't at fault here. Not saying it was heinous or malicious, but he certainly didn't seem to complete the pass safely in my mind. > Pags > > On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 10:58 PM Lan Max <nolanmaxxx@gmail.com <mailto:nolanmaxxx@gmail.com>> wrote: > Zarco’s telemetry: > > ‘the two-time Moto2™ World Champion actually braked later on the lap of the crash than on any other lap during the Austrian Grand Prix..’ > > > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ <http://www.ductalk.com/> > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet <https://www.facebook.com/ducnet> > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net> > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net <http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net> > Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com <mailto:nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> > -- > sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ <http://www.ductalk.com/> > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet <https://www.facebook.com/ducnet> > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net> > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net <http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net> > Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com <mailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com> > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ <http://www.ductalk.com/> > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet <https://www.facebook.com/ducnet> > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net> > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net <http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net> > Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com <mailto:nolanmaxxx@gmail.com> > -- > sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ # > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: caedwards874@gmail.com

I don’t know if this was posted yet but it’s an interview with Rossi. He has quite a buit to say. https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-racing/rossi-take-on-austrian-motogp-crash/?utm_source=internal&utm_medium=email&tp=i-1NGB-Et-QJQ-15N4Mt-1c-7ejB-1c-15NG0w-l50EEda0DP-Cry7B Vicki

Always interesting to hear “inside head” thoughts from the legends. Many of us have had near death experiences. Sometimes they make us think..... Lots of decisions to make in our crazy lives. Hopefully most of them work out favorably. Stay safe, all. STeve > On Aug 20, 2020, at 6:34 PM, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net> wrote: > >  > I don’t know if this was posted yet but it’s an interview with Rossi. He has quite a buit to say. > > https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-racing/rossi-take-on-austrian-motogp-crash/?utm_source=internal&utm_medium=email&tp=i-1NGB-Et-QJQ-15N4Mt-1c-7ejB-1c-15NG0w-l50EEda0DP-Cry7B > > Vicki > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: desmo900cr@gmail.com

Zarco penalizes. Start from Pit Lane. Penalty wasLoad of horseSh!t “Riders must ride In a responsible manner which does not cause danger to other competitors....” Tell that to MM93 Going 220mph side by side is pretty responsible and doesn’t cause danger to others... On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 9:42 PM Stephen Abramson <desmo900cr@gmail.com> wrote: > Always interesting to hear “inside head” thoughts from the legends. Many > of us have had near death experiences. Sometimes they make us think..... > Lots of decisions to make in our crazy lives. Hopefully most of them work > out favorably. Stay safe, all. > > STeve > > On Aug 20, 2020, at 6:34 PM, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net> wrote: > >  > I don’t know if this was posted yet but it’s an interview with Rossi. He > has quite a buit to say. > > > https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-racing/rossi-take-on-austrian-motogp-crash/?utm_source=internal&utm_medium=email&tp=i-1NGB-Et-QJQ-15N4Mt-1c-7ejB-1c-15NG0w-l50EEda0DP-Cry7B > > Vicki > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: desmo900cr@gmail.com > > > > > > To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news: > http://www.ductalk.com/ > and > https://www.facebook.com/ducnet > _____________________ > Ducati mailing list > Ducati@list.ducati.net > http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net > Mailto: nolanmaxxx@gmail.com > -- sent_from@appleMobileDevice~ #