Empathy List Archives

JM

James McKane

Sat, Apr 15, 2023 12:10 PM

Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co.
Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908
https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html

Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI!

Jim McKane
Kitchener, Ontario

Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 <https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html> Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI! Jim McKane Kitchener, Ontario

D

dm60@mweb.co.za

Sat, Apr 15, 2023 1:45 PM

Hello Len (and Jim)

Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source ....

Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time?

Kind regards

Dave Mitchell
Cape Town
South Africa

From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: "James McKane" jamckane@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM
Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI!

Jim McKane
Kitchener, Ontario

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Hello Len (and Jim) Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source .... Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time? Kind regards Dave Mitchell Cape Town South Africa From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: "James McKane" <jamckane@gmail.com> Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI! Jim McKane Kitchener, Ontario ================================= Send a Message to the List - cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com List Archive - https://list.cotyroneireland.com/empathy/list/cotyronelist.list.cotyroneireland.com Join the list by sending an email to - cotyronelist-subscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com To receive the Digest version, send an email to - cotyronelist-owner@list.cotyroneireland.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to - cotyronelist-unsubscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com =================================

LS

Len Swindley

Sat, Apr 15, 2023 2:34 PM

Thanks Dave; this has been quite a task over several weeks as the original entries in the kirk session book and the poor quality of the film were a considerable challenge. There was no set rule, but it was generally accepted that admittance to the first Holy Communion (the Lord's Supper) was taken up by Presbyterian 14-16 year olds (confirmed by referring to the baptismal register).
Of course, the births of many of these young candidates predate civil registration by 25 years, hence their usefulness.
All the best to you,
Len Swindley

From: dm60--- via CoTyroneList cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Sent: Saturday, 15 April 2023 11:45 PM
To: CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: dm60@mweb.co.za dm60@mweb.co.za
Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

Hello Len (and Jim)

Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source ....

Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time?

Kind regards

Dave Mitchell
Cape Town
South Africa

From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: "James McKane" jamckane@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM
Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html

Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI!

Jim McKane
Kitchener, Ontario

Send a Message to the List - cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
List Archive - https://list.cotyroneireland.com/empathy/list/cotyronelist.list.cotyroneireland.com
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Thanks Dave; this has been quite a task over several weeks as the original entries in the kirk session book and the poor quality of the film were a considerable challenge. There was no set rule, but it was generally accepted that admittance to the first Holy Communion (the Lord's Supper) was taken up by Presbyterian 14-16 year olds (confirmed by referring to the baptismal register). Of course, the births of many of these young candidates predate civil registration by 25 years, hence their usefulness. All the best to you, Len Swindley ________________________________ From: dm60--- via CoTyroneList <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 April 2023 11:45 PM To: CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: dm60@mweb.co.za <dm60@mweb.co.za> Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Hello Len (and Jim) Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source .... Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time? Kind regards Dave Mitchell Cape Town South Africa ________________________________ From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: "James McKane" <jamckane@gmail.com> Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908<https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html> Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI! Jim McKane Kitchener, Ontario ================================= Send a Message to the List - cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com List Archive - https://list.cotyroneireland.com/empathy/list/cotyronelist.list.cotyroneireland.com Join the list by sending an email to - cotyronelist-subscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com To receive the Digest version, send an email to - cotyronelist-owner@list.cotyroneireland.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to - cotyronelist-unsubscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com =================================

LG

Lindsay Graham

Sun, Apr 16, 2023 1:56 PM

Thanks again for all that you do, Len and Jim. This one is of particular interest to me -- I've been to the church twice as it is where my great-grandparents, William GRAHAM and Sarah CARNWATH, were married in 1855 just weeks before they migrated to Australia. I'll go carefully through all the CARNWATHs and similar (eg, CONWATH) and see if I can match them to my records. Pity there are no GRAHAMs in the list -- because, I'm pretty sure, it was Sarah's church rather than William's.

Sarah appears in this list as having her first communion in Apr 1853. She would have been about 20 then -- does anyone know whether that was a typical age for first communion in those days?

Lindsay Graham
Canberra, Australia

On 15/4/23 22:10, James McKane via CoTyroneList wrote:

Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html

Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI!

Jim McKane
Kitchener, Ontario

Thanks again for all that you do, Len and Jim. This one is of particular interest to me -- I've been to the church twice as it is where my great-grandparents, William GRAHAM and Sarah CARNWATH, were married in 1855 just weeks before they migrated to Australia. I'll go carefully through all the CARNWATHs and similar (eg, CONWATH) and see if I can match them to my records. Pity there are no GRAHAMs in the list -- because, I'm pretty sure, it was Sarah's church rather than William's. Sarah appears in this list as having her first communion in Apr 1853. She would have been about 20 then -- does anyone know whether that was a typical age for first communion in those days? Lindsay Graham Canberra, Australia On 15/4/23 22:10, James McKane via CoTyroneList wrote: > Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 <https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html> > > Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI! > > Jim McKane > Kitchener, Ontario >

D

dm60@mweb.co.za

Sun, Apr 16, 2023 2:23 PM

Hello Len (and Lindsay)

This is in line with what one might anticipate -- my experience is all based on the Dutch Reformed Church here in South Africa (many of the DRC ministers were "imported Scots" from the Presbyterian Kirk!)

What I can also share, following a visit to Rev. William Chestnutt at the Donagheady Manse (this way back in August 1981) is this:

* Rev. Chestnutt showed me the 2 nd Donagheady Communion Roll and we noted a record for the "first communion" for “David Mitchell, Killymallagh, 1868” . 
* 
* This we now know is (almost certainly) a reference to David Henry Mitchell (son of James Mitchell and Isabella Henry of Killymallaght) who was born on 8 August 1848 . I have his details from his great-grandson, (sadly now the late) David H. Mitchell III of New Bedford, Massachusetts, also confirmation from his tombstone in Massachusetts and from other US records.

So this young man was 20 years of age, or thereabouts, upon his first communion.

I'm still searching for a baptism record for him! (We do have one at Donagheady for his immediately elder brother James Mitchell in 1846, but it seems young David didn't get recorded.)

Kind regards to all

David Mitchell
Cape Town
South Africa

From: "Len Swindley" len_swindley@hotmail.com
To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: "Dave Mitchell (dm60 own)" dm60@mweb.co.za
Sent: Saturday, 15 April, 2023 16:34:12
Subject: Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

Thanks Dave; this has been quite a task over several weeks as the original entries in the kirk session book and the poor quality of the film were a considerable challenge. There was no set rule, but it was generally accepted that admittance to the first Holy Communion (the Lord's Supper) was taken up by Presbyterian 14-16 year olds (confirmed by referring to the baptismal register).
Of course, the births of many of these young candidates predate civil registration by 25 years, hence their usefulness.
All the best to you,
Len Swindley

From: dm60--- via CoTyroneList cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Sent: Saturday, 15 April 2023 11:45 PM
To: CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: dm60@mweb.co.za dm60@mweb.co.za
Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908
Hello Len (and Jim)

Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source ....

Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time?

Kind regards

Dave Mitchell
Cape Town
South Africa

From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
Cc: "James McKane" jamckane@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM
Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908

[ https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html | Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 ]

Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI!

Jim McKane
Kitchener, Ontario

Send a Message to the List - cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com
List Archive - https://list.cotyroneireland.com/empathy/list/cotyronelist.list.cotyroneireland.com
Join the list by sending an email to - cotyronelist-subscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com
To receive the Digest version, send an email to - cotyronelist-owner@list.cotyroneireland.com
Unsubscribe by sending an email to - cotyronelist-unsubscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com

Hello Len (and Lindsay) This is in line with what one might anticipate -- my experience is all based on the Dutch Reformed Church here in South Africa (many of the DRC ministers were "imported Scots" from the Presbyterian Kirk!) What I can also share, following a visit to Rev. William Chestnutt at the Donagheady Manse (this way back in August 1981) is this: * Rev. Chestnutt showed me the 2 nd Donagheady Communion Roll and we noted a record for the "first communion" for “David Mitchell, Killymallagh, 1868” . * * This we now know is (almost certainly) a reference to David Henry Mitchell (son of James Mitchell and Isabella Henry of Killymallaght) who was born on 8 August 1848 . I have his details from his great-grandson, (sadly now the late) David H. Mitchell III of New Bedford, Massachusetts, also confirmation from his tombstone in Massachusetts and from other US records. So this young man was 20 years of age, or thereabouts, upon his first communion. I'm still searching for a baptism record for him! (We do have one at Donagheady for his immediately elder brother James Mitchell in 1846, but it seems young David didn't get recorded.) Kind regards to all David Mitchell Cape Town South Africa From: "Len Swindley" <len_swindley@hotmail.com> To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: "Dave Mitchell (dm60 own)" <dm60@mweb.co.za> Sent: Saturday, 15 April, 2023 16:34:12 Subject: Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Thanks Dave; this has been quite a task over several weeks as the original entries in the kirk session book and the poor quality of the film were a considerable challenge. There was no set rule, but it was generally accepted that admittance to the first Holy Communion (the Lord's Supper) was taken up by Presbyterian 14-16 year olds (confirmed by referring to the baptismal register). Of course, the births of many of these young candidates predate civil registration by 25 years, hence their usefulness. All the best to you, Len Swindley From: dm60--- via CoTyroneList <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 April 2023 11:45 PM To: CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: dm60@mweb.co.za <dm60@mweb.co.za> Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] Re: New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 Hello Len (and Jim) Thanks for posting this. An interesting and largely untapped source .... Anyone able to suggest the typical age (or age range) for new communicants, in the Presbyterian kirk at that time? Kind regards Dave Mitchell Cape Town South Africa From: "James McKane via CoTyroneList" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> To: "CoTyroneIreland.com Mailing List" <cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com> Cc: "James McKane" <jamckane@gmail.com> Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 02:10:16 PM Subject: [CoTyroneMailingList] New Content - Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 [ https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/leckpatrick4.html | Leckpatrick Presbyterian Church, Artigarvan, Leckpatrick Parish, Co. Tyrone, Northern Ireland: Young Communicants 1838-1908 ] Thanks again to Len Swindley for another great addition to CTI! Jim McKane Kitchener, Ontario ================================= Send a Message to the List - cotyronelist@list.cotyroneireland.com List Archive - https://list.cotyroneireland.com/empathy/list/cotyronelist.list.cotyroneireland.com Join the list by sending an email to - cotyronelist-subscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com To receive the Digest version, send an email to - cotyronelist-owner@list.cotyroneireland.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to - cotyronelist-unsubscribe@list.cotyroneireland.com =================================