T
TPB
Sat, Oct 31, 2020 5:49 PM
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used
to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the
feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing.
Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution,
poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese
components (brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the
eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am
installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the
next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about
it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used
to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the
feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing.
Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution,
poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese
components (brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the
eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am
installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the
next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about
it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
VS
Vicki Smith
Sat, Oct 31, 2020 5:54 PM
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to
the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel
and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately
the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes,
suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual
package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the
battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it.
PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:http://www.ductalk.com/
andhttps://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing listDucati@list.ducati.nethttp://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com> wrote:
> I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
> been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to
> the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel
> and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately
> the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
> can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes,
> suspension etc.).
>
> Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
> the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
> using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual
> package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the
> battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
>
> Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it.
> PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
>
> Stuart
> On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:http://www.ductalk.com/
> andhttps://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing listDucati@list.ducati.nethttp://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com
>
KK
Kevin Kachadourian
Sun, Nov 1, 2020 3:28 AM
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon,
and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a
problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity
feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the
body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs
on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new
twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
- power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the
shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between
the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like
- All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a
couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the
throttle response is just about where I want it.
- sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and,
believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system).
I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more
intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one
on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good
comparison.
- handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about
1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those
right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting
used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent
engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot.
So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the
throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
- It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I
had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When
I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the
resistance went away. Nice.
- Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has
while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have
discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a
bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now
his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to
catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I
coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back
on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect
the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the
battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this
as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard
to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give
warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I
believe he is already doing).
- In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard
cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83
Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the
highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to
ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for
Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no
longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith Vicki@ducati.net wrote:
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to
the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel
and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately
the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes,
suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual
package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the
battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it.
PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:http://www.ductalk.com/
andhttps://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing listDucati@list.ducati.nethttp://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon,
and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a
problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity
feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the
body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs
on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new
twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
- power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the
shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between
the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like
65. All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a
couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the
throttle response is just about where I want it.
- sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and,
believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system).
I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more
intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one
on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good
comparison.
- handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about
1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those
right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting
used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent
engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot.
So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the
throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
- It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I
had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When
I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the
resistance went away. Nice.
- Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has
while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have
discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a
bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now
his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to
catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I
coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back
on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect
the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the
battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this
as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard
to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give
warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I
believe he is already doing).
- In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard
cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83
Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the
highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to
ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for
Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no
longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net> wrote:
> No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
> Vicki
>
> On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has
>> been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to
>> the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel
>> and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately
>> the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
>> can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes,
>> suspension etc.).
>>
>> Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in
>> the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not
>> using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual
>> package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the
>> battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
>>
>> Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it.
>> PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
>>
>> Stuart
>> On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:http://www.ductalk.com/
>> andhttps://www.facebook.com/ducnet
>> _____________________
>> Ducati mailing listDucati@list.ducati.nethttp://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
>> Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
>> http://www.ductalk.com/
>> and
>> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
>> _____________________
>> Ducati mailing list
>> Ducati@list.ducati.net
>> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
>> Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com
>>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com
>
T
TPB
Sun, Nov 1, 2020 11:19 AM
Hi Kevin, congrats on the bike. 2 comments that may help...
The regen braking must be adjustable. There should be a pot somewhere
that can tune the level of engine braking you like. Of course if you
turn it down, there will be less regen effect but that's the trade-off.
It is possible to integrate progressive regen braking with the rear
brake pedal but I guess Lightning hasn't done that.
The battery shutting down issue can be caused by the BMS detecting that
one cell voltage has dropped below the set minimum even though overall
battery voltage is still within the limits. Often the BMS has a
bluetooth link so you can see on your phone if one cell is being pulled
down faster than the others. If there is more than 0.5V difference on
the lowest cell, you could have a bad cell or cell group, so maybe its
something to chat to the dealer about.
Enjoy the bike, I'm jealous.
Stuart
On 10/31/20 11:28 PM, Kevin Kachadourian wrote:
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike
Carbon, and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not
a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of
gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not
pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun
runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and
some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
- power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the
shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph,
except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins
suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time.
I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each
time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is
just about where I want it.
- sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly
(and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi
spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the
sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign
up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and
one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
- handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to
about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta
work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One
thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine
braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike,
with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is
like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to
get "neutral" throttle.
- It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure
I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a
bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit
harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
- Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one
has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan
Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride
and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of
Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop
back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed.
When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to
the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on,
and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to
protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the
computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it
just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn
better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and
Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial
down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is
already doing).
- In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my
junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85
Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still
have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I
have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't
mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though
lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see
myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net
mailto:Vicki@ducati.net> wrote:
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
<mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>> wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter
and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from
having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the
throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric
(for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros
had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components
(brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about
so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain.
Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build
to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of
fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this
weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited
about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com <mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com <mailto:veloce916@gmail.com>
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com <mailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com>
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
Hi Kevin, congrats on the bike. 2 comments that may help...
The regen braking must be adjustable. There should be a pot somewhere
that can tune the level of engine braking you like. Of course if you
turn it down, there will be less regen effect but that's the trade-off.
It is possible to integrate progressive regen braking with the rear
brake pedal but I guess Lightning hasn't done that.
The battery shutting down issue can be caused by the BMS detecting that
one cell voltage has dropped below the set minimum even though overall
battery voltage is still within the limits. Often the BMS has a
bluetooth link so you can see on your phone if one cell is being pulled
down faster than the others. If there is more than 0.5V difference on
the lowest cell, you could have a bad cell or cell group, so maybe its
something to chat to the dealer about.
Enjoy the bike, I'm jealous.
Stuart
On 10/31/20 11:28 PM, Kevin Kachadourian wrote:
> Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike
> Carbon, and here's a report.
>
> The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not
> a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of
> gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not
> pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
> As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun
> runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and
> some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
>
> * power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the
> shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph,
> except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins
> suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time.
> I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each
> time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is
> just about where I want it.
> * sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly
> (and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi
> spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the
> sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign
> up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and
> one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
> * handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to
> about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta
> work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One
> thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine
> braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike,
> with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is
> like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to
> get "neutral" throttle.
> * It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure
> I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a
> bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit
> harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
> * Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one
> has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan
> Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride
> and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of
> Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop
> back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed.
> When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to
> the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on,
> and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to
> protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the
> computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it
> just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn
> better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and
> Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial
> down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is
> already doing).
> * In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my
> junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85
> Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still
> have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I
> have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't
> mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though
> lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see
> myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
>
> Sorry if this was a long post.
> Kevin
>
> On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net
> <mailto:Vicki@ducati.net>> wrote:
>
> No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
> Vicki
>
> On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
> <mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter
> and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from
> having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the
> throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric
> (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros
> had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I
> can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components
> (brakes, suspension etc.).
>
> Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about
> so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain.
> Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build
> to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of
> fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this
> weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
>
> Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited
> about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
>
> Stuart
>
> On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
>>
>>
>> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
>> http://www.ductalk.com/
>> and
>> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
>> _____________________
>> Ducati mailing list
>> Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
>> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
>> Mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com <mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com <mailto:veloce916@gmail.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net <mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com <mailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
> http://www.ductalk.com/
> and
> https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
> _____________________
> Ducati mailing list
> Ducati@list.ducati.net
> http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
> Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
SA
stephen abramson
Sun, Nov 1, 2020 1:54 PM
Congrats to both of these electrifying stories, both the build and the buy. I’m all charged up to hear more about both bikes. You both must be amped up with these new experiences. Have fun and stay safe!
On 10/31/20 11:28 PM, Kevin Kachadourian wrote:
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon, and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is just about where I want it.
sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is already doing).
In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net mailto:Vicki@ducati.net> wrote:
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com> wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
> Congrats to both of these electrifying stories, both the build and the buy. I’m all charged up to hear more about both bikes. You both must be amped up with these new experiences. Have fun and stay safe!
STeve
> On 10/31/20 11:28 PM, Kevin Kachadourian wrote:
>> Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon, and here's a report.
>>
>> The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
>> As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
>> power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is just about where I want it.
>> sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
>> handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
>> It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
>> Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is already doing).
>> In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
>> Sorry if this was a long post.
>> Kevin
>>
>> On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net <mailto:Vicki@ducati.net>> wrote:
>> No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
>> Vicki
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com <mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes, suspension etc.).
>> Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
>>
>> Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
MB
Mario Baroz
Mon, Nov 2, 2020 12:48 PM
Very nice review! Thanks Kevin!
Mario
From: Ducati ducati-bounces@list.ducati.net on behalf of Kevin Kachadourian kkachadourian@gmail.com
Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2020 10:28 PM
To: Ducati Owners Group ducati@list.ducati.net
Subject: Re: [Ducati] Fwd: Re: NDC: LiveWire Demo
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon, and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
- power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is just about where I want it.
- sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
- handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
- It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
- Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is already doing).
- In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.netmailto:Vicki@ducati.net> wrote:
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.commailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com> wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.netmailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.commailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.netmailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: veloce916@gmail.commailto:veloce916@gmail.com
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.netmailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.commailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com
Very nice review! Thanks Kevin!
Mario
________________________________
From: Ducati <ducati-bounces@list.ducati.net> on behalf of Kevin Kachadourian <kkachadourian@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2020 10:28 PM
To: Ducati Owners Group <ducati@list.ducati.net>
Subject: Re: [Ducati] Fwd: Re: NDC: LiveWire Demo
Well, I just recently took the plunge and bought a LIghtning Strike Carbon, and here's a report.
The bike feels heavy after my '96 900 SSSP, but once moving, it is not a problem. What feels more odd about the weight is the center of gravity feels higher, which I attribute to the batteries. I have not pulled off the body work to look at the guts yet.
As far as performance, so far so good. No track days yet, but some fun runs on familiar twisties here on the east side of the SF Bay, and some new twisties in the foothills east of Fresno, CA. My thoughts so far:
* power: f**k! I still don't think I've gone WOT yet. Forget the shifting, just twist the throttle, now you're going 90 mph, except, between the quiet motor, no exhaust sound and Ohlins suspension, it feels more like 65. All the power, all the time. I've had the bike back to Lightning a couple of times and each time, Richard adjusts the software, so the throttle response is just about where I want it.
* sound. I stopped missing the sound of the exhaust pretty quickly (and, believe me, I love the sound of the Duck and that Termi spaghetti system). I wonder if the lack of sound makes the sensation of acceleration even more intense. My fantasy is to sign up for two track days with Keith Code, one on their BMW S1000R and one on the Strike. I think that would be a good comparison.
* handling. So far so good. I've got the chicken strips down to about 1/4-1/2 inch on the left and a bit more on the right (gotta work on those right hand bends), so I'm working it a bit. One thing that takes getting used to is the difference in engine braking. The Duck has some decent engine braking, but the Strike, with it's regenerative braking, has a lot. So, closed throttle is like trail braking, and you've got to crack the throttle a bit to get "neutral" throttle.
* It wants to go fast. I was troubled at first by how much pressure I had to maintain on the inside handlebar to stay on my line in a bend. When I started going in a bit faster and driving a bit harder in the bend, the resistance went away. Nice.
* Battery oddities. In addition to the usual range worry that one has while learning the bike (I went through this with my Nissan Leaf), I have discovered one other oddity. Near the end of a ride and battery running a bit low, I was following my friend east of Fresno (he was on my 900 SS, now his 900 SS) and decided to drop back some so I could pull the throttle to catch up with speed. When I whacked open the throttle, the motor cut out. I coasted to the side, turned the bike off, waited a minute, turned it back on, and everything was fine. Seems the computer has programming to protect the battery, so when you ask for more juice than the computer thinks the battery has, or can give without damage, it just turns it off. I see this as a dual challenge: I need to learn better about where it's at with regard to battery capacity, and Richard needs to work on the software, to give warnings, and dial down motor power to avoid total loss (something I believe he is already doing).
* In the end. I'm hooked. Yea, I loved my previous bikes: my junkyard cannibalized Honda 125 (first bike), Honda '73 CB350, '85 Suzuki GS450, '83 Interceptor 750, '85 Cagiva Alazzurra 650 (still have this one), and the highly modified '96 Duck 900SSSP. But, I have no interest in going back to ICE motorcycles. This doesn't mean I don't still watch MotoGP and root for Ducati (though lately, it's been kind of hard). It just means I can no longer see myself on an ICE bike. Whooosh.
Sorry if this was a long post.
Kevin
On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:55, Vicki Smith <Vicki@ducati.net<mailto:Vicki@ducati.net>> wrote:
No worries for the thread hijack. I’m interested in how this goes...
Vicki
On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 1:49 PM TPB <theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com<mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>> wrote:
I bought an older Zero a few years back to use as a commuter and it has been a proper love / hate relationship. Apart from having to get used to the weird feeling of just twisting the throttle and moving off, the feel and convenience of electric (for short trips) is amazing. Unfortunately the older Zeros had really crappy weight distribution, poor handling and I can't even describe the quality of the Chinese components (brakes, suspension etc.).
Anyway, I just happened to have a spare Aprilia RS lying about so am in the process of installing an electric powertrain. Unfortunately I am not using cutting edge tech for the build to keep costs down but the eventual package should be a lot of fun. The motors are in and I am installing the battery this weekend so should have a test run in the next week or 2!
Sorry to hijack the Duc thread for this but I'm pretty excited about it. PM me if you would like to hear more about it.
Stuart
On 10/30/20 6:01 PM, Brian Adrian wrote:
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net<mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com<mailto:theplentifulbrowns@gmail.com>
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net<mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: veloce916@gmail.com<mailto:veloce916@gmail.com>
To get the links and updates on all today's Ducati news:
http://www.ductalk.com/
and
https://www.facebook.com/ducnet
_____________________
Ducati mailing list
Ducati@list.ducati.net<mailto:Ducati@list.ducati.net>
http://list.ducati.net/mailman/listinfo/ducati_list.ducati.net
Mailto: kkachadourian@gmail.com<mailto:kkachadourian@gmail.com>